Topic: Deployment probabilities

[Danno1]

Hey guys, this a great forum. I went to a Navy recruiter at age 18 but was convinced not to join by my mom, who said better get an education and understand the world better before a commitment. At that time, they were eager to take me.

Well now I’m 26 and ready to commit! Unfortunately it's much tougher to get in. And I now have another obstacle: The fiancé. I searched the forum for this question and visited a recruiter. The experience was a disappointment. The recruiter was knowledgeable and a nice enough guy, but I got the vibe he saw I was a white male without an engineering degree, and wanted to move on as quickly as possible. The native high school kid in the booth next to me got a much warmer reception. Again, nothing against the recruiter, I’m sure he’s under pressure and understands the politics of recruitment much better than me, but it was discouraging.

So I didn’t get this question answered: Which trades are most likely, and least likely, to be deployed? I have nothing against deployment, and my preference is MARS and other naval positions which involve heavy deployment, but for my fiance’s sake, I agreed to explore other options. She has a weak relationship with her family and is bad at making friends, and I’m not confident in her mental strength to be alone for long periods of time. Hopefully this will change over time. 

From my research, this is what I gather are the least likely to be deployed for significant amounts of time, in seriously hostile areas, like Afghanistan:

Plumbing and heating technician
Meteorological technician
Communicator Research Operator
Pilot

Others that are certain to spend significant time away from home:

Aerospace control office/Operator
Infantry/Artillery/Armour
Intelligence
Anything naval, incl MARS, hull technician, engineers, Sonar
Health care administration/Medical
Weapons/ammo technicians

Does that sound about accurate?

Thanks
Dan

[ttlbmg]

Hey there, good luck on your application! In terms of lesser deployment positions, I personally think that can be deceiving. Although you may not be deployed in some positions, there will be a great deal of time that you can be away for training, exercises, courses. I will speak to the other side of it, as my spouse is currently a member.

For your fiance, I will say that the military does have a great deal of resources in place to help family members while their significant other is away. While she might not have an easy time making friends, I will say that, at least in my cases, the people my husband works with and their spouses have been very warm and welcoming to me. There are also counselling services, some bases have support groups in place, and the MFRC. There is support for her if you are away.

That being said, it is difficult to have a spouse away on a regular basis. I think you would need to sit down and have a really serious conversation with her about your choices. I'm not sure how many spouses are prepared for "army life," and being a spouse, means that you are apart of it. For my husband, he went on tour before we actually got married to ensure that I could and wanted to handle this lifestyle. The thing is, nothing is guaranteed. I don't know if this helps, but it is just my two cents. Again, good luck!

[ArmyVern]

Well, I just want to point out that, even in recruiting, personnel have different personalities.  Apparently, you are seeking position as an Officer and the lad next to you as an other rank ... two whole different ball-games; trying to compare the two is silly. And, the native Canadian in the booth next to you was being seen by a different person with a different personality than your particular staff. Some people have great personalities, others no so much. Please don't over analyze the situation while forgetting the basics of human interaction. The mountain of which you post is more than likely just a molehill. 

As for the answer to your question to the recruiter about "who deploys the most", it is entirely unpredictable. It is totally dependent upon what missions our government chooses to send us to as participants. I still haven't met an individual who can accurately predict what those folks are thinking. A UN mission could see an "all-Loggie" task force with very minimal zero trade involvement by Canada such as we experienced during our decades in the Golan Heights. We could see a Naval Task Force, such as recently occured in Libya. We could see another mission that closely involves our front-line personnel and their support staff such as Afghanistan.

Your list below is entirely inaccurate as who is tasked to deploy is entirely dependent upon numerous things: mission requirements, tasks, goals, HQs requiring staff, type of mission.

If you are hoping to avoid deployment, or to minimize that, I'd suggest that you seriously consider whether or not the CF is actually for you. Unfortunately, it is what we do and we can't predict where, when, or who our Nation is going to call upon ... or how often that will occur. It's part of the business and that uncertainty is exactly why the CF is considered a lifestyle vice a job. If that uncertainty and unpredictability is really not OK with you, then really consider the consequences of siging on that line.

[Danno1]

Thanks for the replies, it's nice to hear a spouse's perspective too ttlbmg

This has been a delicate issue for her and I, since it's something I've always wanted to do, and has becoming increasingly important to me, given then direction our economic, military and culture is headed (not good on all counts!). I simply can't see myself in any other career or lifestyle long term.

ArmyVern, thanks for clearing that up. You're right, you cant extrapolate much from a simple brief exchange.  I'm actually glad to hear that deployments can't be predicted, I can pass that as justification for applying for the trades I wanted all along I've always wanted to be in the Navy and live near a port town, which would be useful for post-career life skills too.

[Harris]

Just remember too that you won't necessarily be posted to the coast for your whole career.  Depending on the trade and rank achieve, you can certainly expect at least one posting to somewhere like Ottawa for example.  If your trade were RMS Clerk for another example you could be posted to pretty much any unit (including a reserve unit) as well.

[CDN Aviator]

From my research, this is what I gather are the least likely to be deployed for significant amounts of time, in seriously hostile areas, like Afghanistan:

Plumbing and heating technician

Wrong.

Meteorological technician

Wrong.

Communicator Research Operator

Wrong.

Pilot

Wrong.

[Hurricane]

So I didn't get this question answered: Which trades are most likely, and least likely, to be deployed? I have nothing against deployment, and my preference is MARS and other naval positions which involve heavy deployment, but for my fiance's sake, I agreed to explore other options. She has a weak relationship with her family and is bad at making friends, and I'm not confident in her mental strength to be alone for long periods of time. Hopefully this will change over time. 

Dan,

There is more to military life than just postings and deployments. There are NUMEROUS career and non career courses that your Chain of Command could and probably will send you on. I haven't been in the military long, only going on my 4Th year and going on my first deployment. That being said, the 3 years I've been posted to my current base, I have actually been "On Ground" for a maybe a total timeframe of a year. Something to think about with military life, your spouse WILL need close friends if not family support for times you are gone. Something to think about, I would hate to see you sign up and have your engagement fall apart, as some do. However, if the military is something you want to do, follow it. Just know that it is a commitment that you AND your spouse will have to make.

[Eye In The Sky]

There are resources like the MFRCs that can assist spouse's and, if things haven't changed too much, your spouse will become part of that "families left behind" family that tend to look after each other when mbr's are deployed.

Its not all doom and gloom and she will have the choice to become, or not become, part of a bigger family.

 

[Dimsum]

Since you're looking to be in the Navy but want the flexibility of not having to deploy all the time, I'd suggest checking out the Naval Reserve.  I don't know where you live, but if it's near a relatively-large city, there's a unit there.  But, as everyone has said, the mobile lifestyle of the military isn't just due to deployments; courses, postings and other things will make you move around quite a bit - sometimes at short notice.

[Danno1]

Thanks for the advice guys. I do worry about my marriage crumbling, but my incessant chatter about the military will probably cause her to leave me anyway 

I do think the similar circumstances of military spouses and the support centre would be helpful, especially since she's pretty isolated in her daily life here. We live in Toronto, where urban isolation is the norm.

-

I do have another question without an easy answer, rather than start a new thread, hopefully I can just post here. I asked the recruiter, and he was understandably hesitant to give me an answer, since there is no clear answer.

What are the most consistently easier Forces jobs to enter, and what are the more consistently difficult?

Consistency being the key here. I see pilots are currently accepting applications, but I've also read that they are among the most applied for position, and one person listed the odds as 800 to 1. So it's not as simple as checking the website. Im not going to take just any job to get in and try to switch, but it's impractical to not consider the odds when applying.

I asked the recruiter if I could write the CFAT to narrow my options and assess my skills before being procesed into a position, he told me I can't do anything before a position is open.

So, is there a rough list of positions that are generally more in demand, compared to trades that are generally less in demand?

Thanks! And excuse my long post. I figure better to have all my questions in one thread.

[Danno1]

Since you're looking to be in the Navy but want the flexibility of not having to deploy all the time, I'd suggest checking out the Naval Reserve.  I don't know where you live, but if it's near a relatively-large city, there's a unit there.  But, as everyone has said, the mobile lifestyle of the military isn't just due to deployments; courses, postings and other things will make you move around quite a bit - sometimes at short notice.

Thanks for the suggestion, I thought about the reserves. Here's why I decided against it:

1) Training takes so long since it's weekend based. I would prefer to leave my job and do training all at once
2) It can be difficult to switch from Reserve to Regular. The recruiter told me it's significantly easier to switch from Regular to Reserve.

[Danno1]

Voluntarily removed.

[frank1515]

1) Training takes so long since it's weekend based. I would prefer to leave my job and do training all at once

A friend of mine in the Reg Force was on PAT for more than 8 months before he was put on course.  The wait time in the Regs can also be long.  Don't expect to be put on back-to-back course.

[CDN Aviator]

Thus my sense of urgency to get in to the military, ideally within 1 year.

You need to re-evaluate why you want to this. Thats just my opinion of course. You have a pretty skewed view of life in the military as it is, more thought on your part is needed.

and think it's only realistic to consider the competition when doing so.

Consider it all you want but you don't control the competition so all you can do is apply and see what happens.

[1984]

What are the most consistently easier Forces jobs to enter...

A friend just brought his son into the RC in Ottawa (can't speak for what's open in Toronto) and ACISS was open (Army Signals occupations and especially the core occupation seem to always be short manned)

Personally, I think society is at the brink. The history of wars and economic crises show the importance of immigration, a failing middle class, growth of radical groups, declining birth rates, debt, usury (interest) banking, natural resources, and socialism. Every one of those factors is now at the forefront. Being from the Balkans, I've seen the horrific results of debt, socialism, radicalization, multiculturalism, and separation and corruption from the political class.

I can't imagine society lasting much longer without a major crisis, and I want to be trained and prepared to defend my family and my country when the inevitable strikes. Thus my sense of urgency to get in to the military, ideally within 1 year. The average Westerner, in my opinion, is naively detached from the realities of history and human nature and are completely unprepared for this.

Have you been reading The Postman?

[Danno1]

On second thought, it's better to keep my 'predictions' out of this thread. I don't have a crystal ball, and it's not helpful to the discussion at all. This isn't the right place, and might be offensive to some. Sorry for the slip everyone, I'll edit my posts.

I was at a recruiting office on Wednesday, they didn't mention ACISS. I guess the military demands would mirror civilian life: always demand for sciences, engineering, and medicine. Thought suprisingly the demand doesn't seem to be as strong in the skilled trades, ie plumbing, as it is in civilian life. Any other thoughts on this?

CDN Aviator, can you elaborate please, about the point that my perception of military life is skewed? I think my Balkan background does skew my perception of society quite a bit, as well as military life, as just about every male in my immediate and distant family has been in their army at some point, most seeing combat. People like my parents flee from failed states to embrace successful Canadian culture, but now we're seeing a rejection of Western culture from the very people who benefit from it the most, like universities and media. It's really a sad and strange situation.

I have been doing quite a bit of research on Canadian Forces, this isn't a whimsical decision. I agree that I can't control the competition, but I can be knowledgeable of it. If 800 people are applying for pilot, I can realistically evaluate my skills and my desire. There are only 3 spots on an application, though I would be glad to enter at least 6 of them, so it's worth researching.



I appreciate your thoughts guys.

[CDN Aviator]

I have been doing quite a bit of research on Canadian Forces, this isn't a whimsical decision.

You better do more then because so far, you're results are pretty poor. See my post where all i said is "wrong" several times as an example of you being on the wrong track.

If 800 people are applying for pilot, I can realistically evaluate my skills and my desire.

Unless you have the information on a good portion of the other 799 people, you have no idea what you are up against. Applying is the only way you will know.

[Dimsum]

Thanks for the suggestion, I thought about the reserves. Here's why I decided against it:

1) Training takes so long since it's weekend based. I would prefer to leave my job and do training all at once
2) It can be difficult to switch from Reserve to Regular. The recruiter told me it's significantly easier to switch from Regular to Reserve.

1. Not as Naval Reserve MARS (I was one before I went light blue.) Each course is 4 months long (or thereabouts) and with the exception of BMOQ, can be tacked onto an existing Reg F MARS course.  I know of people who did all of their NAVRES MARS training in a year by being put on empty spots in Reg F courses (this was back in the early 2000s but I doubt things have changed that much.)

2. With MARS, it's potentially less likely that you'll be turned down.  The training is pretty much exactly the same up until the point you actually sail, which is the final 2-ish months of the "formal" training process before you get assigned to a ship (in the Reg F.)  Again I may be using some dated info, but there were a LOT of NAVRES MARS officers who switched over to the Reg F in the last 4 years and were scooped up right away (well, as "right away" as the CF can be.)

Again, my info is about 4 years old.  I'd check with HMCS YORK (the Naval Reserve unit in Toronto) but as I said, I doubt things have really changed that much in the training side.

[CDN Aviator]

I would prefer

You will find that what you would "prefer" is not an overriding consideration for the military.

[Macey]

Don't worry about the Mrs..... Go to supply and ADREP one. 

[Diamondwillow]

I think that perhaps you may be over analyzing and trying to *out-think* the possible competition and the CF.   First - It doesn't really matter HOW many people apply - if 50% of them don't pass the medical or CFAT or interview, then that's 50% of the competition gone - then what's not to say you aren't 8th out of 800 who PASSED... but there are only 5 positions available.  There is simply far too much information that you would NEED to put into your equation in order to have an accurate result.  You simply are not going to get that information to fill in the blanks - it will all be speculation and a touch of ESP.. lol.  (if you DID get that kind of information then I would be mad as HELL that someone who is NOT in the CF has access to my file or information that I, myself am not privy to.) 

If you want to do aptitude tests - go to the employment center - they have a GREAT second career program that will help you determine what you really ARE good or interested in.  I had the same questions you did - I wanted to know what *I* would be best suited for in the CF... unfortunately - the CFAT didn't narrow a damn thing down.... it actually broadened my options - but using the employment aptitudes helped me decide.. .   I think you should really just look at what YOU WANT to be doing for a long time... and choose that. 

Your last post sounds like you would apply as a Pilot if you knew you were a shoe in... but if you aren't, the desire maybe really ISN'T there?  I think you may need to re-evaluate why you are looking at certain trades.    So what if 800 people apply... if you don't apply because of the *what if's* you can't answer anyway - then you won't get the job...  period.   (and if you don't apply - then that's one less person *I* need to worry about competing against me.... ) j/k )  Basically - what I am saying is - decide what you WANT To do - and DO IT... don't live with regret and *what if* - AND ... remember - it may SEEM like things take forever... but September (or Christmas) is going to come ANYWAY - it always does.... ALWAYS.

[Dimsum]

Don't worry about the Mrs..... Go to supply and ADREP one. 

I thought that only works in Quebec-based units or foreign postings?  Err....not that I'd try to do that in Australia.  No sirree. 

[Danno1]

thanks for the info guys, I really appreciate it. Thanks for clarifying Dimsum, MARS really was my first choice, and the recruiter did tell me that you can be a Reserve and still work full time, which would be awesome. I haven't done the in-depth research on the position yet, since I haven't totally narrowed it down. Too many options! I find that your first gut reaction tends to be the most reliable, and some studies have confirmed this. After weeks of research, Im still drawn to my initial gut picks.

lol Diamondwillow, I am a textbook 'paralysis by analysis' guy, and I do try to strategize everything. My desire isn't strong for pilot, it was just an example really. I know my skills pretty well, but I also want to be practical. I know many passionately unemployed Freudian BA undergrads, and many successful plumbers who eventually learned to tolerate their job. I have a degree in Business Administration, but want to be useful long term and in the civilian world, that's why I'm strongly considering skilled trades, like Hull Tech and Refrigeration, as opposed to more familiar admin jobs. It's kind of embarassing to me when I have to call the Super to fix my leaky faucet lol.

... ADREP?  I don't get it.

[CDN Aviator]

you can be a Reserve and still work full time,

Be careful with that thought.

... ADREP?  I don't get it.

You can interpret that as "go to supply and request a new one".

[Danno1]

lol ok, good to know.