Topic: Chill out!

[ArmyVern]

Do you have some reason to think you've learnt it in an improper way in the past?  With only a few quite specific exceptions drill is drill whether it's the regular navy, the militia, or the air cadets.  There's always a chance you've been taught something incorrectly, but no greater than the chance that you'll be taught something incorrectly in the future.

Well, given that every single basic course usually hears the following being yelled very loudly on day one of their course:

"OMFG --- You were a cadet weren't you!!"

Former cadets -- stand out in the crowd -- there's a reason it's referred to as cadet drill

[Cat]

That's exactly it. There is a huge difference in the way drill is done between the different cadet elements, so I would have to assume that the CF would be different again. I just want to do things the right way and do those things well.

I've just got the basics; although I'm sure I'm going to be jacked for having been in cadets, some habits just die hard - and until I learn the right way, chances are I'll be doing it the cadet way.

[ArmyVern]

I've just got the basics; although I'm sure I'm going to be jacked for having been in cadets, some habits just die hard - and until I learn the right way, chances are I'll be doing it the cadet way.

No worries, they will knock the cadet drill out of you during basic -- been there, done that (the cadet drill).

[Cat]

No worries, they will knock the cadet drill out of you during basic -- been there, done that.

as long as they replace it with proper drill, s'all good - I just hear alot of complaints on the site about people who are stuck doing things one way when they go on course...I'm getting out of that mindset in advance

there's alot of information on here, I'm just trying to keep my head above water and not make big mistakes going in especially regarding my attitude and willingness to adapt

[ArmyVern]

as long as they replace it with proper drill, s'all good - I just hear alot of complaints on the site about people who are stuck doing things one way when they go on course...I'm getting out of that mindset in advance

there's alot of information on here, I'm just trying to keep my head above water and not make big mistakes going in especially regarding my attitude and willingness to adapt

The best thing to do is relax -- take it as it comes and you'll do just fine. Don't be too anxious, don't be too gung-ho, and don't be a slug. It'll all work out after that.

[MedTech]

hmm, that's what I'd heard....I was oddly concerned about that when I tried to join the first time....

now, heck rock painting sounds like a holiday :p

Just don't try an spray paint your boots. That doesn't work no not speaking from experience...

[N. McKay]

That's exactly it. There is a huge difference in the way drill is done between the different cadet elements, so I would have to assume that the CF would be different again. I just want to do things the right way and do those things well.

Everyone, CF and cadets, all elements, is supposed to be taking their basic drill from CFP 201.  There are certainly some cadet units who are teaching parts of it wrong, but there's no all-encompassing "cadet drill" that differs from "CF drill", nor are there differences in drill between cadet elements.  (Further, there are some CF units whose drill also deviates from what's correct by the book, so neither cadets nor the CF have the market cornered on creative drill.)

If you've seen air cadets drill differently from sea cadets then what you're seeing is a difference in unit practice, not element practice.  The same is true if you see army cadets and an air force squadron drilling differently -- it's in the unit, or possibly the summer training centre or CF school, but not the element or the fact that one is a cadet unit and the other an air force unit.

I've just got the basics; although I'm sure I'm going to be jacked for having been in cadets, some habits just die hard - and until I learn the right way, chances are I'll be doing it the cadet way.

A person could forget that we're all on the same side around here, the way past membership in cadets is looked upon sometimes.  (The CDS was a cadet, after all.)

Well, given that every single basic course usually hears the following being yelled very loudly on day one of their course:

"OMFG --- You were a cadet weren't you!!"

Well, yes, but I suspect that reason is that the DS of BMQ courses will yell something starting with "OMFG" loudly on the very slightest pretext!  (One lad on my course got it because he correctly reported his trade as "musician" the first inspection.)

[Michael O'Leary]

A person could forget that we're all on the same side around here, the way past membership in cadets is looked upon sometimes.  (In case anyone's forgotten, the CDS was a cadet.)

No-one here has been 'looked down upon' simply because they were a cadet, but sometimes it has led to the display of some form of Dunning-Kruger effect, which will attract less than welcoming attitudes.  And cadets don't have a monopoly on that either.

[Cat]

I'm just going on what I've seen, in general it seems that each cadet unit does things differently, but there is more continuity by element. Air cadets have a bad habit of dragging out/singing drill commands, army cadets swing shoulder high, sea cadets...hmm, I haven't had as much experience with sea cadets to notice anything elementally different...but there are differences taht the cadet elements seem to pride themselves on. I realise it's all supposed to be the same, but it's like cadets no longer dig their heels in while marching...my cadet boots are worn down to the nails from diggingin ... just because things aren't supposed to be differnt.. doesn't mean they're not.


this may also be because some cadet units refuse to update their 201s...I've seen some pretty old ones in various squadrons/corps.

Again, this is just my experiance, which is why I'm accepting for now that I know basic drill...however I know I may be a bit off...and if they ever heard me call a command I'd probably be laughed off the square...

[N. McKay]

Dunning-Kruger effect

Thanks for that -- I didn't know there was a name for it.

Yes, no doubt some fraction (well under 100 per cent I'd wager) of cadets, and probably a fairly similar fraction of recruits who were never cadets, show up on Basic with that particular attitude and attract a lot of grief as a result.  But it really does rankle me the way people are so often advised to hide the fact that they were cadets, or forget everything they learned as cadets because it's all wrong, and so on.

[Cat]

Thanks for that -- I didn't know there was a name for it.

Yes, no doubt some fraction (well under 100 per cent I'd wager) of cadets, and probably a fairly similar fraction of recruits who were never cadets, show up on Basic with that particular attitude and attract a lot of grief as a result.  But it really does rankle me the way people are so often advised to hide the fact that they were cadets, or forget everything they learned as cadets because it's all wrong, and so on.

Well I'm all for shouting it from the rooftops, I really do love the cadet system and think it has alot to offer youth(although it's getting a bit girl-guide esqe in some areas). however, unless it's benefitting me, or whoever I'm with, chances are I'm not going to launch into a "this is how we did it" "or this is how it's done" speech. Now, if buddy is using floorwax on his parade boots...chances are I'll lend him some kiwi and offer a lesson in it's proper use....but it's benefitting everyone...*yeah I knew someone who floorwaxed their boots...*

[Intelligent Design]

We had someone at our squadron who floor waxed his boots every year for annual inspection. I think he learned his lesson eventually but I can't say for sure. There are two things I do know: Floor polish is a terrible idea, and parade gloss does NOT turn boots purple! No matter what people say about the stuff... I used parade gloss for 4 years and my boots were still black as licorice.

Anyways, the three things cadets might help me with would probably be understanding how long a parade can be, how to polish boots (Which was a pain to learn), and how to tie a Windsor knot (Also a pain to learn).

[Nerf herder]

parade gloss does NOT turn boots purple! No matter what people say about the stuff... I used parade gloss for 4 years and my boots were still black as licorice.

Correct. They probably heard of someone using Ox Blood polish which does turn the boots purple but with an outstanding shine.

But, alas, I digress.

Back on topic troops.

Regards

[Technoviking]

Ah, drill, dress and deportment: the three "D"s that I remember (vice Defence, Debilitation and Debauchery, or whatever the government talks about nowadays)
Just think, the drill we do now was once BATTLE drill.  Yes, my friends, that's right, forms on the march, turns at the halt, all that nastiness was once a way to move troops around the battlefield!
*sigh*
As for painting rocks, well....just look at my name!  LOL

[RTaylor]

My advice, being a realist and all, is to listen to whats being told to you and try your damnedest to succeed. Trying to make yourself into the supersoldier of tomorrow will lead to failure, but remaining determined and working hard will get you through and possibly noticed in a positive way.

Back when I was a reservist the most hated were the ex-cadets that thought they were better than everyone else. So jaded and full of themselves, and so bruised with the old soap in a sock held to their bunk at 3AM they were. They honestly never got too far until they realized that in order to succeed you had to see yourselves as the same as everyone else and to assist your fellow recruits. This may or may not be an issue on your basic.

Just keep a realistic perspective and dont lose site of your dream. Try your hardest and just keep it going the whole way. If you don't pas the physical off the bat don't fret, they have in place a PT Course that you can work to get yourself up to standards (up to 90 days) but from what I hear they give plenty of rope to hang yourself with.

I myself have shed alot of weight and have been working on my physique but I still know I'm going to end up there for at least 2 weeks. It's not that I don't try, it's that for 10 hours of my day Im spending it at work at a call center (very restrictive), another 2 hours worth of travelling to/from, 1 hour of break and in the free time I lift some weigts or skip rope. On my off days I get out for a hike. I'm almost there, but not quite.

Just be prepared for alot of early days, alot of exercise and alot of good memories. I can't wait for my call for Basic...Im so excited even thought i have to leave my wife and child for a time.

[1988 -18-18]

I was thinking before I head off to Basic it might be good practice some skills that will come up. For instance shining boots, sewing, and knot tying. Is there anything else that will come up on basic that I should learn or get good at. If I'm not messing up on simple things I imagine it would make things easier.

[Kat Stevens]

Sewing is always a handy skill.  Other than that, let them teach you what you need to know at basic.  Not many things are as aggravating as un-teaching bad habits.

[newmet]

I was thinking before I head off to Basic it might be good practice some skills that will come up. For instance shining boots, sewing, and knot tying. Is there anything else that will come up on basic that I should learn or get good at. If I'm not messing up on simple things I imagine it would make things easier.

Hhhmmmm.... Things to learn and practice before you go...open your ears, close your mouth.  Yup, that's about all.  If you already know how to iron shirts, make a bed with 45 degree corners and shine boots, great!  If not, you will have plenty of time to practice    As for sewing, you just do a basic barrel stitch and it's pretty easy, as for the knot typing, we had one class and didn't use it again. 

Go with the right attitude, knowing that you are doing this because you want to and that you are willing to put up with the crap to get to the career you desire.  Basic is 14 weeks of mind games, physical exhaustion and learning.  As my Sgt said "Just put on foot in front of the other and keep moving".  That's what you do when you're tired and just know, it gets better, then worse, then better    Also, keep in mind that they won't kill you.  It took me until about week 11 to realize this    Looking back on it, it was the hardest and greatest thing I have ever done, but you couldn't get me to do it again!   

Best of luck!  Take some allergy pills (hide them) for the Mega, allergies are horrible there!

[MedKAWD]

Wow, I've read all five pages, and pretty much every post says the exact same thing.

-Be part of the team
-Listen to your instructors
-Don't broadcast your previous Cadet "experience"

Three lines, see how easy this thread was to summarize.   



Nah I kid I kid, sort of, good advice to any power tripping cadet WOs who aged out and are now back at the bottom of the barrel. 

EDIT: Ahhh I see, it was newmet over here that drew my attention to this post.  I thought it looked old and familiar.   

[newmet]

EDIT: Ahhh I see, it was newmet over here that drew my attention to this post.  I thought it looked old and familiar.   

Ahhh, but see I was responding to 1988 -18-18 from earlier this month 

[dukkadukka]

I have a question, I didn't wanna start a new thread... I arrive at St Jean on Saturday afternoon, do they feed me Saturday and Sunday?? I would assume so because I start getting paid on that day, do they provide my food, or should I have extra cash to purchase food.

Edited to add: I figured "Chill out" was the appropriate thread because really it's a nonsense question.... the kinda thing I SHOULD chill out over. hahaha

[Michael O'Leary]

I have a question, I didn't wanna start a new thread... I arrive at St Jean on Saturday afternoon, do they feed me Saturday and Sunday?? I would assume so because I start getting paid on that day, do they provide my food, or should I have extra cash to purchase food.

Edited to add: I figured "Chill out" was the appropriate thread because really it's a nonsense question.... the kinda thing I SHOULD chill out over. hahaha

The first two things you should be handed on arrival are a room key and a meal card (a "pass" which gets you into the kitchen and fed).

[dukkadukka]

The first two things you should be handed on arrival are a room key and a meal card (a "pass" which gets you into the kitchen and fed).

Thank you! 

[Buddy336]

No sweat, and about the medicine; don't hide them !  The four principles they use is: Duty, Loyalty, INTEGRITY and courage.  Seriously, do you want to start your course with a label (because they will find them, trust me on that one).  Besides, it's part of the course to share EVERYTHING with your new found friends !

[Eye In The Sky]

Another part of mbr's bringing their own med's to BMQ...they may use them to 'get thru' an illness or injury (whether it be a cold, or an injured ankle or something) that may get worse (so they *take more*, or make the injury more severe). 

Let's use an example where they, say, roll their ankle over.  Not wanting to be the *MIR Commando*, they dip into their Ibuprofen stash, thinking they'll just soldier on thru.  Over the course of a few days, or a week, or more..the actual injury worsens, to the point where they DO go to Sick Parade, and the MIR staff find out it is now a moderately severe injury, and the mbr now gets put on PAT for a 'condition' that might have been dealt with effectively before by 2 days light duties which lead into a weekend off, where the condition may have corrected itself, and the mbr would not have been required into a ST (Suspended Training) scenario.

Sure, its just an example, but one I've seen happen a few times, and not in the mbr's favour where, at a crucial time, say before the field portion where the injury was then serious enough that the staff noticed it, ordered the mbr to MIR, and the mbr was properly assessed and documented with injury X.  Unfortunately, it was immediately preceding the field portion of the course, which was a requirement to pass the course, and you could not complete without medical restrictions/MELs.  Mbr was RTU'd off the crse.

While trying to 'soldier thru' is a good thing, most candidates attending BMQ/IAP do not know the difference between what we used to deem *hurt* and *hurting*.  Hurting was expected, and accepted.  Hurt was "go to the Doc".  An experienced soldier knows his/her own body, and knows the difference between the 2.  Recruits..not so much IMO.  I had a QL3 candidate in 2001 come hobbling down the stairs from the 2nd floor...not knowing I was standing there.  I ordered her to the MIR.  Turned out she had a torn ligament in her knee or something to that effect...caught early enough that it didn't stop her from completing the training, including the mandatory 7 day defensive ex.  The 2 weeks with PT/drill restrictions that were allowable under the CTP/CTS made the difference.

Also...if you don't go to the MIR...it will never be documented in the first place that you were injured.  In my case for the one that counted (back injury), the fact that I had proper documentation made my dealings with VAC almost painless....almost.