Topic: Rations, Meal Claims, No Access to Mess Hall, Etc.--Merged

[HercFE]

Years ago (several) I was in your situation, same Sqn, same quarters, same problem. I had a box lunch delivered with the aircrew meals. It work out pretty good except for the few times my box lunch was "accidentally" eaten by someone else.

[Klinkaroo]

Thanks everyone, going to talk to them first thing in the morning.

[Bruce Monkhouse]

There is a lengthy thread somewhere about something like this where Vern injected her wisdom,...unfortunately, I don't have time to look for it right now.

[gcclarke]

There is a lengthy thread somewhere about something like this where Vern injected her wisdom,...unfortunately, I don't have time to look for it right now.

Is it this one Bruce?

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Is it this one Bruce?

Yes, thank you.
..and now they are as one.

[chubakah]

Ref: Treasury Board of Canada (renamed National Joint Counsel)

I would be careful with this ref, it could be interpreted as civilian policy to assist there collective agreements.  Regardless, we all know that the Military Regulations, Orders and Policies (ok directories, as well) are currently in a flux.....IR need I say more.

The ref policy states, if a mbr is required to work during an unscheduled work time they are entitled to be reimbursed, at a reasonable amount, all expenses incurred.   

I feel the need to counter act this policy with the fact that we are paid on a salary, and expected to place duty before self....are we not always expected to respond 24/7? 

Your call. but CFAO's do not apply, the Aid Du Memoir is not policy, but put in place to guide us as a simple reference....and good luck with QR&O's, and CFAO's.....DAOD's...rare.

This one is fun!

[ArmyVern]

Ref: Treasury Board of Canada (renamed National Joint Counsel)

I would be careful with this ref, it could be interpreted as civilian policy to assist there collective agreements.  Regardless, we all know that the Military Regulations, Orders and Policies (ok directories, as well) are currently in a flux.....IR need I say more.

The ref policy states, if a mbr is required to work during an unscheduled work time they are entitled to be reimbursed, at a reasonable amount, all expenses incurred.   

I feel the need to counter act this policy with the fact that we are paid on a salary, and expected to place duty before self....are we not always expected to respond 24/7? 

Your call. but CFAO's do not apply, the Aid Du Memoir is not policy, but put in place to guide us as a simple reference....and good luck with QR&O's, and CFAO's.....DAOD's...rare.

This one is fun!

Yes, we would be expected to respond 24/7 ... and we'd also be expected to be covered for meals etc if that recall need to occur. You are ordered to work for the second time in a 24 hour period and you are covered - both mileage and meals if required. And, that is one policy that was/is still in effect as of last Wednesday night with a valid pol reference for re-imbursement on claim. Everything didn't stop with those CANFORGENs and if you think it did ... I hope to hell that you aren't working in an Orderly Room somewhere using "your call" on claims. It's not your call Miss Muffet, and never has been.

The NJC did not change it's rules with it's name change.

Oh Yeah -- as for your "this one is fun comment" --- you do realize that there is a whole Task Force of pers away from their homes right now undergoing work-up trg since November 2010 who have no access to common rooms with TV, tie-lines to call home to their spouses/families across Canada, access to transport to go downtown on weekends off etc ... who are and have been receiving sweet-frig-all in the way of benefits because they are "attach posted" for the year instead of "TD'd" for the year? And you -- you think it's funny?? From me to you, on their behalves, kiss my ***.

It's not funny. It's unimaginable that pers "attached posted" away from their families for up to a year (with a further seperation to occur while actually deployed overseas) to do training to deploy overseas are entitled to sweet frig all right now in the way of benefits to assist them with paying for cable or phone calls home once a week etc ...

while those on "TD" to courses in Borden etc for a mere 3 weeks are collecting 17.35 a day for the first 30 days, then 13 bucks a day after that. simply because they are TDd and not attach posted. A whole heck of a lot of them are also travelling home every weekend to see their familes too, and living in quarters with common rooms with TV and tie-line access ... what is wrong with this picture!!??

It's not "fun", it's a situation that needs to get clarified and sorted soonest. It is costing some of us a lot. There are people working hard at the highest levels to sort this all out, please don`t denigrate their efforts at actually helping troops with your .02 cents.

[Pusser]

Ref: Treasury Board of Canada (renamed National Joint Counsel)

I would be careful with this ref, it could be interpreted as civilian policy to assist there collective agreements.  Regardless, we all know that the Military Regulations, Orders and Policies (ok directories, as well) are currently in a flux.....IR need I say more.

The ref policy states, if a mbr is required to work during an unscheduled work time they are entitled to be reimbursed, at a reasonable amount, all expenses incurred.   

I feel the need to counter act this policy with the fact that we are paid on a salary, and expected to place duty before self....are we not always expected to respond 24/7? 

Your call. but CFAO's do not apply, the Aid Du Memoir is not policy, but put in place to guide us as a simple reference....and good luck with QR&O's, and CFAO's.....DAOD's...rare.

This one is fun!

First off, Treasury Board and the National Joint Council are two different things.  The NJC is a forum for the development and negotiation of benefits.  Treasury Board is one of many  members of the NJC, as is the CF.

Secondly, in what way do CFAOs not apply?  Although we are in the process of transforming some CFAOs into DAODs, the basic premises of the policies behind them remain the same.  The chief reason for moving to DAODs was that the Department wanted CFAOs to apply to DND civilians in some cases and legal opinion was reluctant to accept that civilian employees could be ordered to do anything.  Hence the wording in DAODs that CF members are "ordered" and civilian employees are "directed," but I digress.

To the best of my knowledge (unfortunately, I'm not on the DIN at the moment and can't confirm it), CFAO 36-14 (Entitlement to Rations at Public Expense) is still in effect.  This CFAO is convoluted and you have to read the entire thing to understand it, but it boils down to this on this issue.  If you are required to work longer than normal and that extended time goes past a "normal" meal hour, then you are entitled to rations at public expense.  This shall normally be provided from a CF dining facility if possible (if it's closed by the time you get back to the base, it's not possible).  If it's not possible, then you are entitled to reimbursement for actual and reasonable expenses for the meal.  "Actual' means you have to provide a receipt to prove you spent the money and "reasonable" means you are limited to the approved meal rate for the meal in question.

The policy of the CF is that if we put you in certain situations, you are entitled to meals at public expense.  CFAO 36-14 is the regulation that describes how we do it.

On a final note, ArmyVern is absolutely right.